Eric Desrochers

Hello! First, sorry about the cross-post. Those are all groups I find
to be relevant to my querry.

I'm looking for an audio mixer with 4-5 channels plus mics, in the
200-300 USD price range. The feature I particularly need on the mixer
for our application is a booth output that have the main PGM minus the
mics signal.

In other words, the MAIN output have the channels PLUS mics but the
booth/zone output have only the channels, not the mics. This is
obviously to avoid mics feedback in the DJ booth.

I cannot imagine a situation where having the mic signal reproduced in
the booth speakers is a desirable thing, so I thought it would be easy
to find a mixer with such a simple function, but it's not. So far, I
have checked numerous models by Numark, Behringer, Denon, Tascam,
American Audio, Vestax, Gemini, Rane, Pioneer, Stanton and Peavey. Of
the lot, only the Rane MP 24z have it, with internal jumpers mods, alas
way out of our budget. The Behringer DX1000 have it but with a fixed
level output, requiring some external volume adjustment device.

A small regular PA mixer would have this feature and do the job but at
the cost of being overly complicated, having no RIAA preamp and needing
a bunch of RCA to 1/4 adaptors.

Application is an internal high school radio. 15-16 y/o students DJ
operates the equipment so asking them to remember shutting out the
studio monitor before bringing the mics up might be asking too much!
Hence the mic-less output.

Strangely, the current, 15 years old Peavey unit that is in need of
replacement have this function.

Thanks a lot!


--
Eric (Dero) Desrochers
http://homepage.mac.com/dero72

Hiroshima 45, Tchernobyl 86, Windows 95

d parker

The mic "should" be reproduced by the booth monitor. Every vocalist in the
world uses it. Every announcer, every Race caller, every MC/DJ. I cant
think of a studio that wouldnt have monitors that allow the announcer/s to
hear themselves.

A simple trick to remedy any feedback in the booth is to reduce the
offending frequency on the booths EQ. Or maybe find out if its your mics
that are the probelm. Cheap mics love to feedback.

If you really want to do what you are saying though, you could by a second
mixer to mix the audio and mics separately. The audio from the the first
mixer is used as the booth mix and is also sent to the second mixer where it
mixes with the vocals to become the program.

HTH..

DP
"Eric Desrochers" <deromax@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1h3z88p.1mp7whz13pzexaN%deromax@hotmail.com.. .
> Hello! First, sorry about the cross-post. Those are all groups I find
> to be relevant to my querry.
>
> I'm looking for an audio mixer with 4-5 channels plus mics, in the
> 200-300 USD price range. The feature I particularly need on the mixer
> for our application is a booth output that have the main PGM minus the
> mics signal.
>
> In other words, the MAIN output have the channels PLUS mics but the
> booth/zone output have only the channels, not the mics. This is
> obviously to avoid mics feedback in the DJ booth.
>
> I cannot imagine a situation where having the mic signal reproduced in
> the booth speakers is a desirable thing, so I thought it would be easy
> to find a mixer with such a simple function, but it's not. So far, I
> have checked numerous models by Numark, Behringer, Denon, Tascam,
> American Audio, Vestax, Gemini, Rane, Pioneer, Stanton and Peavey. Of
> the lot, only the Rane MP 24z have it, with internal jumpers mods, alas
> way out of our budget. The Behringer DX1000 have it but with a fixed
> level output, requiring some external volume adjustment device.
>
> A small regular PA mixer would have this feature and do the job but at
> the cost of being overly complicated, having no RIAA preamp and needing
> a bunch of RCA to 1/4 adaptors.
>
> Application is an internal high school radio. 15-16 y/o students DJ
> operates the equipment so asking them to remember shutting out the
> studio monitor before bringing the mics up might be asking too much!
> Hence the mic-less output.
>
> Strangely, the current, 15 years old Peavey unit that is in need of
> replacement have this function.
>
> Thanks a lot!
>
>
> --
> Eric (Dero) Desrochers
> http://homepage.mac.com/dero72
>
> Hiroshima 45, Tchernobyl 86, Windows 95

Eric Desrochers

d parker <ozskipper@hotmail.com> wrote:

> The mic "should" be reproduced by the booth monitor. Every vocalist in the
> world uses it. Every announcer, every Race caller, every MC/DJ. I cant
> think of a studio that wouldnt have monitors that allow the announcer/s to
> hear themselves.

Hello and thanks for the reply. I know very well the useage of monitors
for vocalist. I do live sound work for over 15 years! However, every
radio setups I have seen uses headphones as monitors. I can't recall
seeing a situation where the announcer's voice is sent to the monitors
in the same room. The potential for feedbacks in a small studio is very
real, no matter the quality of the mics and monitors and the
equalization, imho.

> A simple trick to remedy any feedback in the booth is to reduce the
> offending frequency on the booths EQ. Or maybe find out if its your mics
> that are the probelm. Cheap mics love to feedback.

> If you really want to do what you are saying though, you could by a second
> mixer to mix the audio and mics separately. The audio from the the first
> mixer is used as the booth mix and is also sent to the second mixer where it
> mixes with the vocals to become the program.

I thought about this. But it's overly complex for our operators. If we
go with the Behringer DX1000, I might install a simple passive
attenuator on the desk beside the mixer and use the mixer's fixed level
tape output (the mix minus mics output).

Thanks again.
--
Eric (Dero) Desrochers
http://homepage.mac.com/dero72

Hiroshima 45, Tchernobyl 86, Windows 95

Randall Phair

Have you thought about a used Rane MP24Z ? I picked one up on e-bay a while
back for about $300.
"Eric Desrochers" <deromax@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1h3z88p.1mp7whz13pzexaN%deromax@hotmail.com.. .
> Hello! First, sorry about the cross-post. Those are all groups I find
> to be relevant to my querry.
>
> I'm looking for an audio mixer with 4-5 channels plus mics, in the
> 200-300 USD price range. The feature I particularly need on the mixer
> for our application is a booth output that have the main PGM minus the
> mics signal.
>
> In other words, the MAIN output have the channels PLUS mics but the
> booth/zone output have only the channels, not the mics. This is
> obviously to avoid mics feedback in the DJ booth.
>
> I cannot imagine a situation where having the mic signal reproduced in
> the booth speakers is a desirable thing, so I thought it would be easy
> to find a mixer with such a simple function, but it's not. So far, I
> have checked numerous models by Numark, Behringer, Denon, Tascam,
> American Audio, Vestax, Gemini, Rane, Pioneer, Stanton and Peavey. Of
> the lot, only the Rane MP 24z have it, with internal jumpers mods, alas
> way out of our budget. The Behringer DX1000 have it but with a fixed
> level output, requiring some external volume adjustment device.
>
> A small regular PA mixer would have this feature and do the job but at
> the cost of being overly complicated, having no RIAA preamp and needing
> a bunch of RCA to 1/4 adaptors.
>
> Application is an internal high school radio. 15-16 y/o students DJ
> operates the equipment so asking them to remember shutting out the
> studio monitor before bringing the mics up might be asking too much!
> Hence the mic-less output.
>
> Strangely, the current, 15 years old Peavey unit that is in need of
> replacement have this function.
>
> Thanks a lot!
>
>
> --
> Eric (Dero) Desrochers
> http://homepage.mac.com/dero72
>
> Hiroshima 45, Tchernobyl 86, Windows 95

wyldeone

Why not use 2 mixers 1 for the mic and the other for the booth...
Thats the way I acomplish this when setting up clubs...
-----
Liquid Digital Online - Online Planet of Beatz
http://liquiddigitalonline.com

Eric Desrochers

Randall Phair <rbcrphair@adelphia.net> wrote:

> Have you thought about a used Rane MP24Z ? I picked one up on e-bay a while
> back for about $300.

Oh my! I would do it if possible. But our school system purchasers
have no concept of "online buying", "credit card payment" and "used
goods purchases".

I have to find all my equipment from brick and mortar stores, preferably
located in a 100 miles radius from our site, that will submit a formal
quote and accept net 30 days payments... Well outside of eBay's
parameters!

After years of waiting for funds to buy a new Symetrix 421 AGC, I
finally bought one myself on eBay at a tenth of MSRP and kinda donated
it to the school. But a 300$ mixer is another matter! I'm not the
f***ing salvation army!

But thanks anyway!

BTW, do you like the Rane unit?

--
Eric (Dero) Desrochers
http://homepage.mac.com/dero72

Hiroshima 45, Tchernobyl 86, Windows 95

Eric Desrochers

wyldeone <wyldeone@liquiddigitalonline-dot-com.no-spam.invalid> wrote:

> Why not use 2 mixers 1 for the mic and the other for the booth...
> Thats the way I acomplish this when setting up clubs...

Additionnal cost, complexity and desk bloat!

I'm really puzzled that this function is not more readily present. Most
mixers seem to have numerous features, the bulk of them we won't use :
crossfader, general EQ, samplers, echo, inserts, beat counters, etc)
but lacks those two that are important for our application : having 2
mics inputs on full size linear faders and from XLR inputs, and having a
PGM minus mics monitor output.

I'm thinking more and more the Behringer DX1000 with an external volume
control added will cut it. This unit also have audio specs that remains
more of a pro sound board than an economy Pyramid mixer.

Thanks all!

--
Eric (Dero) Desrochers
http://homepage.mac.com/dero72

Hiroshima 45, Tchernobyl 86, Windows 95

dj

Get a RANE and give it a rest here ...this is a no brainer

djfixx


"Eric Desrochers" <deromax@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1h3z88p.1mp7whz13pzexaN%deromax@hotmail.com.. .
> Hello! First, sorry about the cross-post. Those are all groups I find
> to be relevant to my querry.
>
> I'm looking for an audio mixer with 4-5 channels plus mics, in the
> 200-300 USD price range. The feature I particularly need on the mixer
> for our application is a booth output that have the main PGM minus the
> mics signal.
>
> In other words, the MAIN output have the channels PLUS mics but the
> booth/zone output have only the channels, not the mics. This is
> obviously to avoid mics feedback in the DJ booth.
>
> I cannot imagine a situation where having the mic signal reproduced in
> the booth speakers is a desirable thing, so I thought it would be easy
> to find a mixer with such a simple function, but it's not. So far, I
> have checked numerous models by Numark, Behringer, Denon, Tascam,
> American Audio, Vestax, Gemini, Rane, Pioneer, Stanton and Peavey. Of
> the lot, only the Rane MP 24z have it, with internal jumpers mods, alas
> way out of our budget. The Behringer DX1000 have it but with a fixed
> level output, requiring some external volume adjustment device.
>
> A small regular PA mixer would have this feature and do the job but at
> the cost of being overly complicated, having no RIAA preamp and needing
> a bunch of RCA to 1/4 adaptors.
>
> Application is an internal high school radio. 15-16 y/o students DJ
> operates the equipment so asking them to remember shutting out the
> studio monitor before bringing the mics up might be asking too much!
> Hence the mic-less output.
>
> Strangely, the current, 15 years old Peavey unit that is in need of
> replacement have this function.
>
> Thanks a lot!
>
>
> --
> Eric (Dero) Desrochers
> http://homepage.mac.com/dero72
>
> Hiroshima 45, Tchernobyl 86, Windows 95

Randall Phair

The MP24 is in our back-up rig, our main board is a Rane MP-44. The only
mixers I would use are Rane. So I guess you can tell how I like them. They
are great.
"Eric Desrochers" <deromax@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1h437of.1g6svcl1xbkkdeN%deromax@hotmail.com.. .
> Randall Phair <rbcrphair@adelphia.net> wrote:
>
>> Have you thought about a used Rane MP24Z ? I picked one up on e-bay a
>> while
>> back for about $300.
>
> Oh my! I would do it if possible. But our school system purchasers
> have no concept of "online buying", "credit card payment" and "used
> goods purchases".
>
> I have to find all my equipment from brick and mortar stores, preferably
> located in a 100 miles radius from our site, that will submit a formal
> quote and accept net 30 days payments... Well outside of eBay's
> parameters!
>
> After years of waiting for funds to buy a new Symetrix 421 AGC, I
> finally bought one myself on eBay at a tenth of MSRP and kinda donated
> it to the school. But a 300$ mixer is another matter! I'm not the
> f***ing salvation army!
>
> But thanks anyway!
>
> BTW, do you like the Rane unit?
>
> --
> Eric (Dero) Desrochers
> http://homepage.mac.com/dero72
>
> Hiroshima 45, Tchernobyl 86, Windows 95

DjSteve

Any Mixing desk can do what you want.


http://www.guitar.com.au/pa_systems/...1202-VLZ%20PRO
..htm


"Eric Desrochers" <deromax@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1h438eu.damuxxvpbq68N%deromax@hotmail.com...
> wyldeone <wyldeone@liquiddigitalonline-dot-com.no-spam.invalid> wrote:
>
> > Why not use 2 mixers 1 for the mic and the other for the booth...
> > Thats the way I acomplish this when setting up clubs...
>
> Additionnal cost, complexity and desk bloat!
>
> I'm really puzzled that this function is not more readily present. Most
> mixers seem to have numerous features, the bulk of them we won't use :
> crossfader, general EQ, samplers, echo, inserts, beat counters, etc)
> but lacks those two that are important for our application : having 2
> mics inputs on full size linear faders and from XLR inputs, and having a
> PGM minus mics monitor output.
>
> I'm thinking more and more the Behringer DX1000 with an external volume
> control added will cut it. This unit also have audio specs that remains
> more of a pro sound board than an economy Pyramid mixer.
>
> Thanks all!
>
> --
> Eric (Dero) Desrochers
> http://homepage.mac.com/dero72
>
> Hiroshima 45, Tchernobyl 86, Windows 95